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 A little side project....

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Kiwi



Posts : 461
Join date : 2010-04-21
Age : 21
Location : Palmerston North, New Zealand

PostSubject: A little side project....   Tue Jul 20, 2010 12:50 am

Just finished these tau.













I tried a few new techniques on these the OSL is a bit hard to see but I'm happy about how it turned out.
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Laney



Posts : 3352
Join date : 2010-02-13
Age : 40
Location : Colchester, Essex, England

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 20, 2010 2:05 am

Very good work - are you planning on a squad of them?

The colour scheme works really well and the basing is superb (you really get the sense of the tau stalking through destroyed concrete battlefield).

The bright, richly coloured rust works very well against the grey of the base and provides an extra point of interest - shows you've got a good eye! Very Happy

OSL is a challenging technique and you've made a strong start. Practice the technique and it will get more and more effective. The main principle is often less is more (my eldar exarch was a prime example of too much OSL, until I fixed him).

In the interests of helping you get better: The top of the tau's heads are a little rough. This could be due to sculpt, but I reckon it's probably due to paint thinning. A touch more water (just an extra dip of your brush is enough) will help give you a smoother finish (and tau are all about smooth finish). You may need an extra coat - but it's worth it. The trick is (for me at least) to take some of the paint/liquid off the brush first, otherwise it runs and pools and annoys you and I found myself always using too thick paint instead (and still do sometimes!). But with a bit more thinning you will gain greater paint control.
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DeafNala



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:08 am

VERY NICE! The more I look at them the better I like your choice of colors. The bases ROCK! VERY WELL DONE! What a Face
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edward



Posts : 443
Join date : 2010-05-05
Age : 22
Location : Palmerston North, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 20, 2010 3:41 pm

the tau look really good i like the green lighting

p.s when r u gonna show your orcs?
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franzyland



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Age : 45

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 20, 2010 10:26 pm

Nice. What are the rubble pieces on the bases made of? Cardboard buildings FTW!
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edward



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Wed Jul 21, 2010 12:18 am

yeah kiwi has a tonne of carboard ruins

and icecream box scenery
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Kiwi



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Wed Jul 21, 2010 12:32 am

These guys were really just a few minis I wanted to paint trying a few new things on like not using metallics and trying OSL.

@ 02Laney Thanks, I do try to water down my paints maybe not, the heads may look a bit rough because I tried a lighter dry brush or because of the glue they were coated in when Edward got them, which seems to have dammaged the plastic. I would like to start a tau squad but these are the only models I have and I can't afford more so maybe later...

@ Deafnala Thanks, that means a lot coming from you.

@ Edward NEVER those orcs are terrible pale . That's the only cardboard building, the rest is print out Embarassed , not great but hopefully good enough untill I can get you making some.

@ Franzyland The basing is chopped up sprue with matchsticks and pen springs Very Happy. Yeah cardboard buildings are quick and free.
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edward



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Wed Jul 21, 2010 12:52 am

your orcs are cool
speacially the boss,..who shot my captains arm off with a bow
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Mordheimer



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Thu Jul 22, 2010 2:37 am

I like the color scheme... VERY original for Tau. I do not like much the tan or red that people tend to use... and this blue scheme is VERY refreshing! cheers

On the OSL... it is a hard technique, easy to overdo. My suggestion, to add to Laney's comments, is to pick ONE source first... makes easier to work it. For example, take this guy...


Excellent model, GREAT pose. Now, think what you want to convey... remember, this is about tricking the observer. Do you want me (the observer) to focus on the barrel of the gun, the electronic sight, the wrist console or the 'eye'? Sure, I'm looking at your model VERY close (in the photos), but still I got bombarded with all this stuff and the focus got lost. You can simulate light SOURCE (direction) from somewhere else by using the "Gem Technique" and then pic one element to be the source FROM your model.

For example... take these Necron Tomb Spyders. Can you see where the "light" is coming from?


If you guessed from the "top-left corner"... you are WRONG. Just Kidding The eyes of the robots simulate a single point of light, and thus your brain puts the pieces together... then I used lighter colors to get a reflection on the carapace. Here a close-up of the eyes. Notice the different shades of red (from maroon to orange) and the white dots.


Now... the focus I want you (the observer) to have is the barrel of the gun. Subtle... the side barrel seems to glow (actually it does not) because your brain put the light on the OTHER side, and this color is 'too bright' to be on the dark side. The inside of the nuzzle is slightly red... but your brain 'knows' it has to be pitch black, so it automatically assumes (because of the barrel) that there 'must be' something bright inside... the cannon is about to fire a big laser! Shocked

You could do the same for your Fire Warrior. The gem technique on the main eye... so it looks 'evil', then slight green on the nuzzle to simulate energy on the inside. I would use the gem technique on the sight (simulates a laser) but then use the wrist console thingy... then the observer will know that thing emits its own light, rather than reflect other.

Here another sample of the gem-technique... it creates the illusion of LOTS of light, which amplifies the Ranger's face. Sorry for the camo. It was my 1st try. Just Kidding


See? Even I painted some fairies at one point! Just Kidding Hope this helps... keep practicing. You are VERY talented, and this thing tests the best of the best. I'm 100% sure you get it in no time! cheers

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Laney



Posts : 3352
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Age : 40
Location : Colchester, Essex, England

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Thu Jul 22, 2010 8:52 am

Really useful information from Mordheimer on the light source, especially the gem advice - that technique is very effective.

@ Kiwi: It could be either the glue (mostly) or the drybrushing - which would emphasise the rough areas. The paint is much smoother than my initial comments probably suggested and you are getting better and better with each project!

A note on drybrushing: Drybrushing is a really valuable technique to have (and often maligned by 'experts' - who probably feel you should have to spend hours gettign the same effect!). The one thing that limits it however, is the creation of texture - making it really useful for metallic armour e.g. chainmail, fur, skin (with the help of washes), but that reduces the value on smooth surfaces (like tau and space marine armour - though I have seen it used really well on space marines).

Instead you might want to try overbrushing as a similar, but alternative, technique. Overbrushing needs an oldish brush
(or it will waste a good brush). First load the paint on the brush and wipe off the excess (though not as much as the drybrushing). Then gently run the brush over the area to be coated. This should give a smooth cover to the raised areas of the model (you need to reload the brush regularly), leaving shadows in the recesses. Layering is the next step on again and can get very sophisticated. Overbrushing is quick, simple, but not as flexible as layering.

Cheers Laney Very Happy
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Kiwi



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 12:33 am

Thanks guys

@ Mordheimer You are totally right about the OSL you should adapt that to a tutorial, very helpful. I'll have to try the jewel technique sometime though my brush may not be small enough for those tiny white dots. Nice Tomb Spyders, but you painted Fairys?!

@ 02Laney Yeah, drybrushing probably was not such a good idea especially with the glue, next time I will try overbrushing.
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Laney



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 3:18 am

@ Kiwi: A fine detail brush will do - just don't overload the brush. Alternatively, I was reading a painting blog by a bloke who uses cocktail sticks for his detail work (not tried it myself yet - might make my eyes less wonky).

The gem technique is great for developing brush control and is the same as that used on space marine eye lenses.

Ta Laney cheers
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Skraag



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Join date : 2010-03-22
Age : 37
Location : Goettingen/Germany

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 3:48 am

Cocktail sticks are way too big for detailed painting, the most important thing (besides thinning your paint) is a good brush tip. I paint most of my orks with a size 3 brush. As long as the tip is pointy the size of the brush is not much of a problem.
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Mordheimer



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 5:13 am

Kiwi... seriously. Don't judge me man. Sad We all did shameful things in our youth. Some people lived a life of crime, other did drugs... I carry the stigma of painting fairies... for money none the less! The shame... the horror... but I needed the money! I swear I used it to buy milk and diapers for my kids!

Hehehe... I painted LOTS of Eldar (maybe that is the reason I don't like the space fairies that much) for sale. That is how I learned to gem-technique. I will try to make a tutorial.

BTW... You know that the sizes of the brushes go 5 (vehicles), 4, 3, 2 (Basing), 1 (models), 0 (details), 00, 0 3 (same as saying 000), 4 0, etc... for MY details I use a 0 10 brush... and I just got a 0 30 brush! Brushes are your tools... take care of them.

@ Skrag: a Size 3 brush?!? You are INSANE... or really good. Try keeping a 0 5 brush for details. You will be amazed!

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The Mordheimer - Death Squads' Chief Editor & Ninja Designer. Bursting with ARACHAS' Dev-Powah™! Puke
Can't wait until someone invents a time machine so I can go to the specific day in the past that I volunteered for this, so I can kick my own ass.

Support Bacteria; it is the ONLY culture some people have!
Since I ask "What do you think?" to all Staff, I have included it here to save time.

DoZer Flamethrower Mordheimer Justice NEEDS to be Served! Maybe 3rd Degree burns will teach you not to Tom Sawyer me to work!

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Skraag



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 5:39 am

I admit it, for the checkers and the eyes I used a 0 brush, but the rest was done with a size 3. I do have a collection of 0/3 to 0/10 brushes but I rarely use them. Not during summer, when the paint dries so fast...

As long as they are made of good quality natural hair with a fine tip there's no problem. Mostly I use red sable Kolinsky brushes.
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Laney



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 10:41 am

I need to get me some decent brushes - I buy the ones in the GW store (the quality since they changed them has dropped through the floor). Sable Kolinsky brushes you say? I'll check out my local art store see what I can pick up.

Anyone got any idea how GW brushes translate into the O OO OOO sizes. They are standard? detail?, fine detail? I have taken to using the standard brush more often recently (just to try and get the paint on more quickly!)

Cheers for the insight Skraag.

Laney
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Skraag



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 10:49 am

I haven't used GW brushes for ages (I used the red ones10 to 15 years ago) and their quality was awful back then. Last thing I heard was the quality has improved since then but if you say otherwise i'd better not try them again.

My best guess is that the detail brush roughly translates to 1 and the finde detail to 0 but I may be wrong and this can be standard and detail.
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Mordheimer



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 11:37 am

Unfortunately I do not know how the 'practical names' (drybrush, vehicles, fine detail) translate to 'industry standard names' (3, 0, 000, 0/510, 0/20). Let us know what you find!

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The Mordheimer - Death Squads' Chief Editor & Ninja Designer. Bursting with ARACHAS' Dev-Powah™! Puke
Can't wait until someone invents a time machine so I can go to the specific day in the past that I volunteered for this, so I can kick my own ass.

Support Bacteria; it is the ONLY culture some people have!
Since I ask "What do you think?" to all Staff, I have included it here to save time.

DoZer Flamethrower Mordheimer Justice NEEDS to be Served! Maybe 3rd Degree burns will teach you not to Tom Sawyer me to work!

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Laney



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Age : 40
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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:26 pm

Tau tactica suggests that fine detail = 00 and detail brush = 0, slim tank brush (whatever that is) = 2. You just knew that another geek would have got there first! Just Kidding

So maybe for very very fine stuff I need to look elsewhere.

Ta Laney
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Kiwi



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:04 am

My turn to be judged... I only have one (size 1 I think) brush, though that's still a definite upgrade from what I painted my orcs with:



I found it lying in a draw.....
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Mordheimer



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:01 am

HOLY SHIT!!! confused

Kiwi... Honestly, this confirms it... you have MORE talent than DeafNala, Laney, Dozer and Skraag PUT TOGETHER if you paint your models with only that piece of junk. Fuck... we need to start addressing you as Master Kiwi. Your Brush in NOT Size 1... it is Size CRAP! You need some new brushes man.

Also... you must take care of your brushes. Never, ever, EVER get paint in the base of the hair! I know it happens from time to time... but it looks like you decided to mix paint with your brush... in the bottle! If paint gets up there, the hair expands and messes the individual hair follicle composition... splitting the brush like a fan, so you don't have a sharp point.

Look at that brush Master Kiwi... and tell ME how in the name of the Emperor's Athlete's Foot you pretend to paint eye pupils and expect them to look 'nice'?!? I remember you complaining some time ago how hard it was to do it... DAMN! Now I know why! You are one sadistic puppy... torturing yourself like that! Twisted Evil Seriously Master Kiwi... you are talented. I have seen your models improve dramatically and your Green Stuff skills are to KILL for. You want to improve more? Get some new brushes. For the sake of the world (so we don't miss your great talents) I will post some tutorials on brushes... I know they will help you. The rest of the gang are way better than me painting, so listen to what they have to say.

AND... be 100% sure I will NAG you about this for DECADES! So be ready to submit pictures of your brushes at a moment notice, soldier! Imperial Guard


PS: I definitely need that whacking-with-a-newspaper emoticon! So... when are you going to change your ALIAS to Master Kiwi? You earned it!


EDIT: I could NOT resist... check this link!

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The Mordheimer - Death Squads' Chief Editor & Ninja Designer. Bursting with ARACHAS' Dev-Powah™! Puke
Can't wait until someone invents a time machine so I can go to the specific day in the past that I volunteered for this, so I can kick my own ass.

Support Bacteria; it is the ONLY culture some people have!
Since I ask "What do you think?" to all Staff, I have included it here to save time.

DoZer Flamethrower Mordheimer Justice NEEDS to be Served! Maybe 3rd Degree burns will teach you not to Tom Sawyer me to work!

.
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edward



Posts : 443
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Age : 22
Location : Palmerston North, New Zealand

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:15 am

master kiwi..you defiently deserve that accolade

amd to think i thought you were exaggrating about your crappy brush
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Laney



Posts : 3352
Join date : 2010-02-13
Age : 40
Location : Colchester, Essex, England

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:46 am

There's a potential Golden Demon hiding underneath that brush mate. Next investment some new brushes Smile .

Any more side projects to share - anything Mordheim, Death Squads?

Cheers Laney cheers
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the_real_Deus



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Age : 35
Location : Göttingen, Germany

PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 27, 2010 4:55 am

Argh!
It hurts to see a brush like this. Please get some new brushes!
I'm using the GW-Basecoat, GW-Standard and GW-Detail brushes for everything except drybrushing and coating varnish. I can recommend them. Using them for almost 2-3 years and they are still in good shape.
But every brush is in better shape than yours Rolling Eyes

Dreadnought Thought of the day: He who lives for nothing is nothing. He who dies for the Emperor is a hero. Dreadnought
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DoZer



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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Tue Jul 27, 2010 9:40 am

Thats just horrible.....

I would suggest non-GW brushes. They just changed the way they manufacture them, and they are total crap.

What I would suggest is Reaper Mini's brushes. They are cheaper than GW's, and are of a much better quality. They have any size you would want, anything from Large dry brushes all the way down to 30/0.

Basic Brush Pack

Brushes

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PostSubject: Re: A little side project....   Today at 1:17 pm

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